STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
Cardinal Blase Cupich joins us next. He is the Archbishop of Chicago, appointed by Francis. He's also a member of the College of Cardinals, the group that will soon help to elect the next pope. Cardinal Cupich, welcome to the program.
BLASE CUPICH: Thank you. Thank you for having me.
INSKEEP: There are so many people - because Pope Francis continued meeting people until the last day of his life, there are people who today are able to say, I saw him just yesterday. I saw him on Easter Sunday. You must have seen him a number of times over the years. When did you last speak with Francis and what was it like to be with him?
CUPICH: Well, I was at a meeting in which he gathered with a number of us in November, and it was a brief conversation I had with him, but that was the last time that I had any kind of exchange with him.
INSKEEP: And what was he like to deal with?
CUPICH: Well, he was always very sharp with his mind. He had - he was very incisive in his thought. He asked penetrating questions and always with a good sense of humor. He always looked for an opportunity to put people at ease with that humor of his.
INSKEEP: I suppose his overt humility must also have helped to put people at ease when meeting somebody in such an exalted position.
CUPICH: Well, he could do some serious things, but never took himself seriously.
INSKEEP: I want to pick up on something that we heard there from Jason DeRose, our religion correspondent. He said that Francis did not change the core teaching of the church, but at the same time, it does seem that he changed the tone. He brought his own tone to the job and also the personnel, and I guess you're an example of that. He elevated so many people. How different is the church than it was 12 years ago?
CUPICH: Well, I think what he wanted to do was to bring forward the inspiration of the Second Vatican Council and put it into practice. But a core aspect of his ministry really is rooted in the gospel, and that is the gospel of the mercy that God gives us and offers us. He pointed out that Jesus always took the first step to go after people and that's how the church should work as well.
We should be a field hospital, making sure that we're going out to people to offer them the care and the mercy of God.
INSKEEP: What does that mean for people who are not clerics, people in their daily lives?
CUPICH: Well, I think it's rooted in an understanding that he had of himself, that he was chosen to take on the role that he did in the life of the Church as an ordained person because he himself experienced the mercy of God. And he wanted everybody else to also have that experience so that they would show mercy to one another. Our world is a lot better off when we cut each other a little bit of slack, when we give another person another chance, when we show mercy.
So many of the conflicts in the world and in our own families can be overcome if we follow that way that he offered to us.
INSKEEP: Now Cardinal Cupich, it is, of course, very early, but the pope was 88, was in poor health, so people had time to think about what came next. What are you and other cardinals looking for in the next pope?
CUPICH: Well, I think it's probably too early to even give thought to that because a lot of us are in a moment of mourning and grieving. We surely want to make sure that the important initiatives that he made are carried on. Again, it's because of what took place in the Second Vatican Council. But right now, I think we're focusing on comforting the people as they mourn the loss of the Holy Father.
INSKEEP: When you say the Second Vatican Council, of course, you're talking about a moment in recent history when the church tried to open up a little bit, or was seen as trying to open up a little bit, and following up on that in more recent years. Talk me through the process, then. What should we expect over the next few days with the funeral and the next few weeks with the papal conclave? What happens when?
CUPICH: Well, the funeral ordinarily takes anywhere between four and six days after the death of the pope. And then there is a nine-day period of mourning. And then after that, I guess we will get instructions from the camerlengo, which is Cardinal Farrell, an American, who will be, in fact, running things as we go into the conclave. Since it's my first time, I'm really not sure exactly what all the dynamics are and I'm just going to listen very attentively.
INSKEEP: I'm told that so many of you are new that many of you will be meeting each other for the first time when that conclave begins. Does that sound right to you?
CUPICH: Well, we did have - the pope did call us together as cardinals during one of the consistories about two or three years ago. So we did have the opportunity to get to know each other.
INSKEEP: Final thing in a few seconds - how will you be remembering the pope in Chicago?
CUPICH: Well, I think I'll be remembering him as an individual who transformed the life of the church in bringing the Gospel of Mercy back to the center of what we should be doing.
INSKEEP: Cardinal Blase Cupich is the Archbishop of Chicago and a member of the College of Cardinals. Cardinal Cupich, thanks so much.
CUPICH: Thank you. Good to be with you.
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